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ChronicD
Sponsor
Location: Sweden
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 Posted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 10:33 am What are you putting forward - that 1.2mm is safe??? |
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| Quote: | | NO - a lot of helms in use in NZ are less than 2mm thick - I have seen one before that appeared to be less than 1mm thick (flimsy as h*ll but someone was using it). |
I think you are missing the point here - we are talking about global guidelines, something that everyone can follow and be assured that they are safe under their helm as people in know say so.
Standards are meant to be higher then necessary, not borderline. We know that a lot of helms are less then 2mm, but how many are less then 1.6 - i dont think that many.
| Quote: | | 1.2mm this helms are fine IF you make it from separate peices - if someone was to cold dish a helm from 1.2mm sheet the final bowl would be a lot thinner than 1mm by the end of it and thus insufficient. likewise a spun bowl has a fairly even final thickness, although I dont like the way they look on a helm. |
Youve just said it yourself mate; THE IF is the problem - Marshals cant know how well a helm is made so assume its not great and use a standard based on that - in other words even if it was dished out of 2mm then at no point would it be less then about 1.4mm a safe enough thickness.
It is ultimately a question of worst case scenario and the guidelines for that.
Personally, it should be 2mm and full face for head blow. Almost all seniors wear full face as we are aware of the risk and then we turn around and say that open face is OK to newbies. I mean WTF we are meant to be looking out for these people.
Dan
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The only verdict is vengeance; a vendetta, held as a votive, not in vain, for the value and veracity of such shall one day vindicate the vigilant and the virtuous. |
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allfiredup
Location: Taumarunui
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| Posted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 5:53 pm |
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Hi Everyone - thought I would add my two cents here as well.
I agree with everthing you said Dan - but you would have to severly dish the 2mm to get it to 1.4mm.
I do think that there are some helms out there that shouldny be only any feild of combat.
| Quote: | Want to make a NAAMA headblow helmet. Don't have any 2mm steel. If I shape a helmet using cold-raising (not dishing) using 1mm mild steel, then promptly make a sightly smaller one and fit it inside the other one, so it's actually 2mm thick in total...Will that meet general safety requirements? Or does it have to be made out of single sheets 2mm thick to start with?
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An idea ive had for you - you could try making a scale helm with a under helm.
so what you would end up with is scale over the helm making it acceptable in any standard of metal weapons.
I will find a pic of this - I just have to get the scanner working.
cheers
Justin
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Ignorance is bliss, knowledge is power.
www.afultd.com |
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Frosty
Location: Palmerston North
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| Posted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 10:07 pm |
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is anyone going to give a straight answer of yes or no instead of turning it into a debate about whether or not yes should be yes or no should be no when in fact no is a possible yes?...just curious 
if you really want to debate if it would work why dont you test it? make it and beat the snot out of it. simple way to settle a debate..hell. give me a stump and a hammer and ill do it
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lament not where you failed to achieve but where you failed to seize opportunity |
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Bogue
Sponsor
Location: Palmy
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| Posted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 10:27 pm Not likely |
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Frosty still wants to know:- | Quote: | | s anyone going to give a straight answer of yes or no instead of turning it into a debate about whether or not yes should be yes or no should be no when in fact no is a possible yes?...just curious |
OK then....NO
And this was a No after further thought.
But it's your gourd.
cheers
Bogue |
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ChronicD
Sponsor
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 11:07 pm My last post |
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Hey guys, this is my last post and will not be argumentative
After Justins point of note that it would be hard to dish something from 2mm to 1.4 - i thought i would go and look at the math.
here is a great website that explains what occurs when you dish something
http://chestofbooks.com/crafts/metal/Sheet-And-Plate-Metal-Work/Spherical-Bowl.html
I think we have been missing a crucial point - that the thickness that is in question is that of the finished product.
The website shows in figure 223 that to achieve a uniform thickness in a bowl = to that of the original sheet a certain reduction is size should occur. In other words if you are not starting with a pattern that follows this example and instead use something smaller - the dish cannot have the same thickness and will be less.
This is a bit off topic - sorry about that.
As for asking for a definitive answer - I would still say no. It is bad practice and shouldn't be done unless absolutely necessary. Ie we are at war and that is all that is available.
Dan
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The only verdict is vengeance; a vendetta, held as a votive, not in vain, for the value and veracity of such shall one day vindicate the vigilant and the virtuous. |
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thorsson
Location: Levin
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 9:54 pm |
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| its a no from me 2mm is best thats my bit.. |
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