An National Open Tournament. Who'd be interested?

[Mad Jim]

Well amongst those photos [of the Wisby Battle] near the end was one on one tornament, where the combatants were in full armour, the whole lot look cool.
Although I think in start of this thread Duxfield had put forward the notion of it being a combined event [EHA, Re-en,Jap,SCA etc.] which could work if we are all protected, but then it comes into far tomany dramas.
For a full period tornament [full armour] it would be very costly to join, especailly if you wanted decint armour and not just GDFB or the likes.
A European Historic tornament would not require plate/heavy armour and thus be cheaper ,but then it would be limited to those with the knowledge of such arts..

[Callum]

[Mad Jim]

A question for a 'Full Foot Tournament', would that mean that all had to be fully plated? What would be the min armour requirement? Would it be limited to just the 14th C. as I'd love to partake in such an event but I quite prefer the 15th C. and would much rather aquire armour from that era...

[Callum]

I'm looking at a format that will allow participation with progessive levels of kit.

For example:

Dagger on Dagger could be done in soft kit only if you use wasters of some sort. However, I would prefer steel and this would require gambeson and leather gloves. Not sure if we need head protection for this.

Sword and Buckler and Longsword would require above plus either semi rigid or rigid torso armour and head protection.

Pollaxe would require above plus either semi rigid or rigid limb armour.

As John says, it is a work in progress for me so I'm still not set on anything final.

Also I am looking at 1400 AD plus or minus say 25 - 50 years. So given the huge change in armour over that period we should be hopefully able to accommodate mostly everybody who may be interested.

[Mad Jim]

That sounds good, I am wanting to get my grubby hands on a late style kettlehelm that has the eye slots, fit that with a bevor, and other plate, pretty much there is a picture of the sort of look I want near the start of Hans Talhoffers 'Fight Earnestly' buch.... only drama is that it'll take the next ten years to put together!

[JohnF]

Callum, I'm slowly moving from kit that is 13th C + "Medieval" towards late 14th. What are your requirements for the foot workshop you intend to hold?

[Callum]

Hi John,

There are no specific requirements for the training workshops at least for the initial ones.

[English Warbowman]

Silver,
There is absolutely no need to apologise as you have done nothing wrong However I think that we might have been talking at cross purposes, when I was writing of kit I actually meant clothing and overall presentation for a public display. I can't get into a discussion as to what is
appropriate protective wear etc for edge weapon combat because that is not my gig.
What I am interested in is to try and establish what level of accuracy in weapons/equipment and clothing are acceptable for a public display. I don't that this has been debated to any length and what about the question - what does the paying public want to see at an event? Having been on both sides of the fence as a spectator and participant I have my own views which I will post on a new thread.

[pmel018]

Hi Callum
for dagger vs dagger face/neck/throat protection is necessary even with the cut down shinai as shown in the video I posted. With wooden or steel weapons even more so. So may techniques aimed at that area. Its pretty hard to hide a fencing mask though.
Phil

[Silver]

[Callum]

Thanks Phil.

We are quietly working away on our dagger on dagger tournament format as part of an elective system of weapon choices for Order of the Boar foot tourneys and had arrived at the same conclusions.

For the tourney workshops we have decided on a minimum kit standard of gamebson, fencing mask (we can provide a few of these) and leather guantlets with rigid cuffs and box. We can also provide the wooden daggers for this workshop. For public displays the fencing mask to be replaced with full face period helm, appropriate hose/footwear and assume also steel rondels at this stage.

We decided on the rigid cuffs because Fiore uses a number of scissor locks using the body of the rondel on the wrist, we found that in our test sparring that the rigid cuff is essential for safety.

For our tourney fights we are not having an accumulated points system so once somebody achieves one of a number of situations the fight is over. These conditions are:

-- Successful point attack.
-- Successful disarm/take down/lock
-- Successfully driving the opponent out of the arena/into the barrier.

The next step for me is now to organise an initial 4 hour workshop at the Upper Hutt Martial Arts Academy for those who are interested in taking part in this (either as combatants or referees). This will allow us to involve at least the more local interested people in the fine-tuning of the system and if there is interest I could look at presenting the system in other parts of NZ. The dagger on dagger format lays the foundation for the other elective weapons (sword and buckler, longsword and poll axe) so once we have fine tuned and safety tested this format we should be able roll out at least the sword and buckler and long sword workshops in fairly short order.

So I am wondering who else would be interested in taking part in the initial seminar in Upper Hutt? I am looking at a Saturday afternoon or a Sunday mid-morning to mid afternoon and charging $25 per person for facility costs. Also, given the number of other events in the last quarter of this year (Nelson Camp, NAAMA and Eketahuna Camp) is there room for this workshop this side of New Year or should I schedule it for January?

[Callum]

[Silver]

hmmm alright not much point in getting a gamby then if I can just wear padding under the chain
could just use my dark ages gear
would be just the same.

[JohnF]

[pmel018]

Hi Callum
I concur fully regarding the gloves. I use a pair of Police riot gloves, they have very long cuffs with some sort of foam built in to cuff and knuckle, i back these up with a pair of escrima forearm guards which work extremely well and cost very little(about 15 pounds)
heres a link http://www.eskrimador-supplies.com/Sparring_Equipment.html
Hmmm looks like Auckland Martial Arts Supplies have something similar from Adidas https://www.amas.co.nz/custom.cfm?&action=subcat&categoryid=5&subcatid=30
The thin ones work best in my experience.
I used this combination through a couple of 2 hr classes at this years Fightcamp that focused on the scissor trap and variations, afterwards I had minimal pain and bruises
Phil